Am I abusing the crate training?

[soniaswang]

Hi, this is Sora's mom again. I know there is a lot of info on this site about crate training and house training and I have red a lot of them...but I just want to make sure that what I am going to do is right.
Yesterday, Sora has been home in her crate alone from 8am to 12pm and then again from 12:30pm to 5:30pm. She's only 11 weeks old. I know that's too long for her to stay in the crate. But I just got her and haven't found a dog sitter yet. She's been calm. But she peed and poop in her crate, of course. I am thinking to hire a dog sitter and ask her to come by sometime mid afternoon. I myself will go home at lunch time. In this way, the longest time she will stay in the crate would be 4 hours. Is this ok or should I just leave her in the bathroom with her crate's door open and the pee pad? She's not doing potty outside yet and I am currently training her on the paper. She hasn't finished her shots yet and since we are going to move soon, I plan to start training her outside in the new home.
I guess I just need some confidence about what I am doing. Is my plan a ok one or even 4 hours are too long for her? I realized that she could hold for 4 hours if she got to do her business before going into the crate. but she just doesn't always do that.
Thanks so much!
Sonia

[soniaswang]

Judy,
Thanks so much for your reply!
Starting yesterday afternoon I am putting Sora in the bathroom. She somehow seemed hated this new idea more than being in the crate alone. But at least she no longer needs to go potty in her crate. She did most of her business on the pad except one randomly. I am quite proud of her given the fact that she's been trained for only 3 days!
She gets excited when I am home, which is very understandable. She does her version of Frenchie 500, running up and down in the hallway between the bathroom and the living room like a crazy rabbit. Cannot believe this is the same dog napping on the sofa next to me every evening for hours. I can sense that her way of protesting is escalating day by day.

I am getting a petsitter tomorrow. Hope this will ease her (and my) anxiety a bit. :)
Sonia

[soniaswang]

I have some follow-up questions...today is the second day Sora's been in the bathroom on her own during the day time while I was at work. The pet sitter came twice today to visit her. Despite the fact that now she has free access to the pee pad, she's been doing her number 1 in the crate. I don’t even remember how many times I have cleaned her mess.
Somehow Sora decided to do her #1 in the crate and #2 on the pad (not really ON the pad but in the place I always put the pad down bc she literally shredded the pad into pieces). I feel that she’s really not handling this being alone thing well, at least not as good as some of your babies by reading your posts.
I am very frustrated:( I tried to feed her in her crate, put a nice comfortable bed in the crate, leave the food bowl in the crate...none of them worked. She just continued to do her business in there). I heard it’d be really hard to correct a dog once she feels ok to eliminate in the crate. I had her for not even a week. I want to do something right to correct this as quickly as possible!
I am not sure what I should do to stop her doing her business in her crate. Any suggestions? Please help! (Sorry for so many frustrating posts screaming for help. I don’t know what to do without this site)

Sonia

[slakker]

One thing we found is that the space you give her needs to be small. Just big enough for her to stand up, turn around and lie down. It may seem cramped, but if she has a corner to do #1 in and be reasonably far enough away, she'll likely go in her crate.

If the crate is too big now, use a plastic box like a Rubbermaid to make it smaller.

[gmacleod]

I'd suggest that you take the bedding out of the crate. It might seem mean, but it isn't really - she isn't going to be sleeping on the bed after she's pee'd on it anyway. And the reason she's choosing that spot to pee is that it is nice and absorbant and will take the pee away.

LOL - I know that the pee pad is also nice and absorbant and will soak up the pee, but apparently she doesn't. Or she thinks her bedding does it better. If you take the bedding away for a while, you'll have a better chance of getting her to pee on the pee pad.

[soniaswang]

I cannot tell you how much better I felt just seeing so many warm responses and advice here when I logged in this morning! I feel lucky to just have you guys here with me :)

The crate (actually it's a kennel, the type you use for air travel) is medium size and I've put a plastic bin in the back to make it smaller since day one. But it might still be big for little Sora. I will try to find something this weekend to make it even smaller.

I will follow Gmacleod's suggestion to take the bedding away to see what happens.

Judy, Sora doesn't drink water much, though she probably did yesterday bc her pee was almost colorless, which was diff from usual. I will tell the dog sitter not to give her too much water also.

Though Sora did all her biz again in her kennel last night despite my effort of waking up twice to take her to the pad, she succeeded in doing both #1 and 2 at the right place this morning before my leaving. ( I watched like a hawk). Of course she got her favorite treats for them! appicon

I have one more question: last night when I got home I found her stomach was very bloated and hard. I watched her closely to see if she's feeling any uncomfortable. She wasn't. She didn't eat much last evening but ate quite a lot this morning though her stomach was still bloated and hard. I gave her a little yogurt hoped that could help. If it's still the case this evening, I plan to take her to the vet. Any idea why could this happen? I did not change her food and I don't think she had any gas. She looked like she gained weight over night.
Thanks so much!
Sonia

[soniaswang]

I went back to see Sora during the lunch time. She seemed doing fine. She might have eaten her own poop bc apparently she did her business but nothing much left there. :eek:
Her belly is still big and hard. I doubt that she has worms because she just got off Albon and some other medicine to cure her coccidia.
I think I am going to bring her to the vet this evening. She has no access to soap. I don't know if she ate too much yesterday during the day bc I don't know how much food the dog sitter acutally gave her. Her stool was ok (at least to me) since it's not soft.
She looked normal. But I feel that she pooped less. Could a dog have constipation? I don't even know how much and often she should poo. Sorry about such a topic. I hate to associate my cute Sora with poop all the time, but at the moment that's all in my mind, and even my dream :o

[soniaswang]

Judy and gmacleod, you were so right about the bedding...I took away the bedding I always put in the crate and just like that, Sora stopped peeing in her crate!!! She did do her number 1 twice in her crate since my last post but I could tell she was trying to get to the corner in the back of the crate. I made her space in the crate even smaller and disciplined myself to make sure that she didn't get too much water during the evening and went to bathroom everytime before she went into the crate. Guess what, other than the two poops, she hadn't had an accident in the crate or anywhere in the house during this weekend. I am just so proud of her! appicon
I did take her to the vet Friday afternoon. The vet gave her more worm med but said she should be fine. Sora seemed to have constipation. I gave her more yogurt and now her stools are softer. But she looked painful when she does her number 1. I hope she'd feel better soon.
Thanks so much to everybody! Cannot tell you enough how much I appreciate your help!!!
Sonia

[gmacleod]

Good to hear :)

If you think she's constipated, you could give her some canned pumpkin to help loosen things up (plain pumpkin, not the pie filling - that is spiced). Pumpkin is one of those handy vegetables that can be used for both firming up or loosening stools. A tablespoon added to her food would tend to make the stools firmer, but double that and it has the opposite effect. Sooo - you could try giving her two or three tablespoons. Metamucil is another good stool-loosener, but I'm not sure on the doseages there.

[soniaswang]

I will try the canned pumpkin! Aren't you guys knowledgeable about dogs! :)

I will definitely gave your kisses to Sora. She LOVEs kisses. She's such a sweet little puppy. She even stopped crying after going into her crate. And she slept through the entire night (7 hours) without making a sound last night. I think she decided to settle down with her new mom. :lol:

I will stay calm and patient. It's been only a week or so, I am amazed by Sora's achievement. I am lucky to have such a sweet little Frenchie.

[sakirby]

hey, soniaswang.

philly huh. i JUST moved from there! i just missed you and your new pup. hey, let me know if you have questions about vets in the city or just local stuff with your dog. i know some fun local things for you and your new pup to do so, let me know if you have any questions. oscar is my frenchie and he is a year old now. but, i experienced all the puppy stuff with him in philly and i met lots of cool frenchie people there. so i would be glad to let you know what is going on in philly frenchie wise if you don't already know.

having a pup is a crazy time. oscar ended up having worms and some bad vet experiences but, he is doing great now.

what do you feed your pup? i found that after i switched oscar to raw, a lot of his digestive issues cleared up right away. the pumpkin is a great idea too. oscar had major diarrhea for a month or so after i got him. i tried everything and raw feeding was the answer.

anyway, good luck!!!! it sounds like you are doing great and care so much about your little girl. you have come to the right place. i was a totally niave and inexperienced when i arrived at this site. i googled everything french bulldog because i had no idea what i was doing. the knowledge and support i have gained here was a LIFESAVER. i am for sure a better dog owner because of this site. i have learned so much. i hope you find it to be as great of a resource. ask away. search my old posts, i certainly asked ALOT of questions!!!!

[soniaswang]

Sharon
Thanks so much for your message! Actually I am moving away from Philly too :( , in only three days. We are moving to NJ.
Before I bought Sora, I joined a philly frenchie lovers' group and met with some Frenchie owners, so I do know there are many wonderful owners in the area. I am sad I am moving away without even introducing Sora to any Frenchies in the group, Sora is finishing her shots just today...
I really hope I can find a group like such in the Princeton area. So far I haven't found anything yet. Will keep trying. Really want Sora to have some Frenchie friends soon! :)
I feed Sora Solid Gold's puppy food. Tried to switch to California Natural and Innova bc Sora was not very impressed with Solid Gold. She loved Innova but it gave her too soft stools and very bad gas. CN also gave her bad gas. So, now we are back on SG. Once we settle in Princeton, I will start her on raw, probably Bravo. She's too thin. I really hope that she'd love raw and start to gain weight.
This site is a LIFESAVER for me too! I learned so much here and contine to learn each and every day. I red your posts too. Though I haven't start raw feeding yet, but I feel I am comfortable with it bc I feel I have experienced it with your guys!
Thanks once again for your message. I am gaining more and more confidence day by day by visiting this site and learning from everybody.
Good luck with you and your Frenchie as well!
Sonia

[Haus]

Sonia, you mentioned that you limit Sora's water intake in the evening for crate training purposes. If she suffers from constipitation, I think that maybe you should reconsider limiting her water intake, because a lack of water can cause as well as exacerbate constipation, and it might be one reason why she looks to be in pain when pooping. Just a thought. Congrats on your new puppy!

[soniaswang]

Thanks, Haus!
Sora no longer has constipation. Thinking back, the breeder gave her Nutri Stat since she wasn't eating at all when she was having cocacidia. I continued to gave her it after I brought her home in the first week bc she wasn't eating much. I think the Nutri Stat was the cause of the constipation.
But I will watch her water intake and if I see her stools become too hard again, I will let her drink more water.Thanks again!